Reduce time to be busted for laggers

[[TC] Shino]

If you are really feeling this way because it's hard to bust a lagger then maybe you just shouldn't chase them in the first place, this would solve the issue you're having as Sonic said, 'they knew it's pointless and likely to be a waste of time' So why pursue a suspect with bad lag when you know what the outcome will most likely be anyway?

In my eyes there is no reason to change anything to do with the bust timer. As there are ways you can avoid this issue in the first place, plus its actually not that hard to bust someone who lags, and what if someone has a high ping because they're from the other side of the world? how would it be fair that there bust time would be 3 seconds because of lag they have no control over. I can see why you made the suggestion and I understand it annoys you, just my two cents

I honestly think imputing this into the insim would be a waste of time, time that could be spent working elsewhere. Its been the way it has been for as long as I can remember, so I don't really think its needed.

[[TC]►Cam◄]

Yeah that's a fair point, it is their choice as to whether they chase them in the first place, but I don't think lag should have to be a factor as to whether or not you chase someone.

[Borja]

I think that I know where Tingle's come from. It's all about when you're chasing someone and the lag on porpouse when it's getting boxed for escape.

Anyways, I think that this should be applied, but in case that the lag it's happening only when been on chase, dont kik them when them are without chase

[Adorable]

AFAIK this is a COPs and Robbers server that is heavily focused on chases, but what if COPs choose not to chase because Robbers have a poor connection to the server? that sounds like no more COPs and Robbers.

Shino Wrote:elsewhere

Like what? /

[Tingle]

(2017-08-14 13:11)Huski Wrote:  

(2017-08-14 10:51)Tingle Wrote:  

(2017-08-14 10:23)Huski Wrote:  

(2017-08-14 08:46)Tingle Wrote:  Laggers are innately not equal to non-laggers and therefore should not be treated equally. Laggers have an advantage due to their ping and this advantage should be eroded. There is no logic to equality in this case. I can see from the results that this is quite a controversial suggestion.

How about we ban all non EU players?

That would be silly though, wouldn't it? Chases are very different to normal driving. Perhaps your lack of understanding is due to how few hours you've spent as a cop.

I will simplify my first response here so I know it'll get through.

You are not obliged to chase anybody, if someone has a ping thats high and you know you may get triggered because of it don't chase them.

Now if you see this as me being harsh, no, I'm putting it bluntly.

I do not require a near on moronic simplification of the flawed point you are clinging onto. Of course there is no obligation to chase somebody, however, if you wish to properly carry out your role as a cop (which I often do), you do not want Mr Hagwalah breaking every road law with no repercussions.

(2017-08-14 18:37)Shino Wrote:  If you are really feeling this way because it's hard to bust a lagger then maybe you just shouldn't chase them in the first place, this would solve the issue you're having as Sonic said, 'they knew it's pointless and likely to be a waste of time' So why pursue a suspect with bad lag when you know what the outcome will most likely be anyway?

In my eyes there is no reason to change anything to do with the bust timer. As there are ways you can avoid this issue in the first place, plus its actually not that hard to bust someone who lags, and what if someone has a high ping because they're from the other side of the world? how would it be fair that there bust time would be 3 seconds because of lag they have no control over. I can see why you made the suggestion and I understand it annoys you, just my two cents

I honestly think imputing this into the insim would be a waste of time, time that could be spent working elsewhere. Its been the way it has been for as long as I can remember, so I don't really think its needed.

See the above.

(2017-08-14 20:04)Adorable Wrote:  AFAIK this is a COPs and Robbers server that is heavily focused on chases, but what if COPs choose not to chase because Robbers have a poor connection to the server? that sounds like no more COPs and Robbers.

My point exactly.

[Ghutra]

So just because you don't chase a 330ms ping player copping becomes pointless? Pls, dem excuses. RP everything you want, but if you gonna trigger everytime you chase a lagger, then why you keep doing it?. It's like walking into the same trap all the time hoping something better happens the next try. Again, nobody is putting a pistol on your head to chase EVERY player you see on the server.

At the same time I see cops with 180-220ms ping copping. So should they also be revoked from their licenses and forbid taking the test because of their ping? Nope. If you gonna lower the bust time, then make it for all or don't do nothing.
You need to reunite people, not split them apart. Its like starting to ban drifters, TC would end up empty.

A few people take advantage of their ping to escape? Yes, not gonna deny that, but implying that every player with high ping should be punished makes no point here. What's next? People with high ping can't brake speedlimits? Can only drive 50%res UF1? Ban every non-EU players?. If you said those ppl who lag on purpose to escape the chase I'd have voted yes, but nope, you aim for EVERY player with high ping.

As Shino said above: You don't like chasing laggers, then don't chase them. Change your path m8, you are stumbling with the same rock again and again and again.

[SO•Huski]

"I do not require a near on moronic simplification of the flawed point you are clinging onto. Of course there is no obligation to chase somebody, however, if you wish to properly carry out your role as a cop (which I often do), you do not want Mr Hagwalah breaking every road law with no repercussions. "

1:12.2
Hagwalah & Tafeet are banned on public roads.

---

I also believe the 69.77% of people speaks about the points made against the idea in this thread over the 30.23%.

[Adorable]

(2017-08-15 05:44)Huski Wrote:  I also believe the 69.77% of people speaks about the points made against the idea in this thread over the 30.23%.

It is true that 69.77% have refused the idea, however there is no denying that laggers, RB4 tank and sand camper aren't an on-going issue, that paired with some pushing and you do have an invincible Robber.

Quote:you do not want Mr Hagwalah some robbers breaking every road law with no repercussions.

[Tingle]

(2017-08-15 05:44)Huski Wrote:  "I do not require a near on moronic simplification of the flawed point you are clinging onto. Of course there is no obligation to chase somebody, however, if you wish to properly carry out your role as a cop (which I often do), you do not want Mr Hagwalah breaking every road law with no repercussions. "

1:12.2
Hagwalah & Tafeet are banned on public roads.

---

I also believe the 69.77% of people speaks about the points made against the idea in this thread over the 30.23%.

AD sums it up nicely.

[Tingle]

I wasn't too surprised by the outcome of the poll and hence why I made it a public poll from the outset. Analysing those who voted for either yes or no was somewhat interesting...

Firstly, we have the average distance from the server for those who voted yes or no:


Unsurprisingly, those who voted 'no' (to implementing the suggestion), were on average 32% more miles away from the server than those who voted 'yes'. This was calculated using the country codes provided on the user's statistics page.

I then thought let's consider the voters' cop and robber XP:


As the data shows, both groups of voters had higher cop XP than robber XP. However, what the data also tells you is those who voted 'yes' had 107% more cop XP on average than those who voted 'no'. This is some indication that those who voted yes have more of a clue about what they're on about. Though admittedly, there is a higher error term attached to 'yes' voters due to the smaller sample size.

Let us also consider how much time the voters have spent playing the role as either a cop or a robber:


We can see that those who voted 'yes' had spent 68% more time as a cop than those who voted 'no', again, clearly showing those who voted 'yes' have more of an idea about the effects lag has on a chase than those who voted 'no'.

Country Breakdown:

Spoiler (Click to View)

Doesn't really show you much other than Great Britain and Czech of Republic were the most divided countries on the issue.

All in all, I do not believe the suggestion should be wiped out based solely on the poll. It is evident that there are strong biases present in the data and those with the copping experience to make an educated vote have been drowned by the robbers (quite rightly) seeking to protect their own interests. I wholeheartedly believe such a change would help to bring more stability and fairness to chases.

(2017-08-15 05:44)Huski Wrote:  I also believe the 69.77% of people speaks about the points made against the idea in this thread over the 30.23%.

As the above shows, your point lacks substance.

[[TC] Brad]

Wait, you're doing research & statistics for other threads but leaving this one to go stale?!

http://forum.city-driving.co.uk/showthre...#pid246919



I do like your stats, though

[Barney [CA]]

Voted now. Pls calculate again.

Btw the Cops lagging(already as soon as the ping is above ~140) is a much bigger problem.

---

Edit: must...resist....answering....brad

[[TC]►Bez◄]

I voted no. Laggers aren't that big of an issue if you don't chase them in the first place.

I would say you Tingle, have wasted 99.9% of your time.

[Tingle]

(2017-08-16 20:10)Brad Wrote:  Wait, you're doing research & statistics for other threads but leaving this one to go stale?!

http://forum.city-driving.co.uk/showthre...#pid246919



I do like your stats, though

All in due to time, all in due time. It's on its way.

(2017-08-16 20:11)Barney Wrote:  Pls calculate again.

I lol'd.

(2017-08-16 20:14)Bez Wrote:  I voted no. Laggers aren't that big of an issue if you don't chase them in the first place.

I would say you Tingle, have wasted 99.9% of your time.

If you had read more than just 5% of this thread, you would have seen there is a strong argument against that point.

[[TC] Kyle]

A quiet day by any change Tingle?

[Tingle]

(2017-08-16 20:41)Jack Wrote:  A quiet day by any change Tingle?

Only if your days are 45 minutes long.

[Ghutra]

So, now you try to disqualify those who voted 'no' just because they didn't have x XP, or x hs copping. It's not just a matter of saying "Oh, he voted no, he obviously doesn't know anything".

Quote:We can see that those who voted 'yes' had spent 68% more time as a cop than those who voted 'no', again, clearly showing those who voted 'yes' have more of an idea about the effects lag has on a chase than those who voted 'no'.

You don't even need to be a cop to note that high ping is an issue, so this isn't a matter of "this guy knows more just because he cops".

Just because some people don't cop here doesn't mean they didn't cop on another server. Altho this server is more advanced, the same principles remain.

What's the point of the country breakdown even for?.

Quote:If you had read more than just 5% of this thread, you would have seen there is a strong argument against that point.

The argument is that you get triggered everytime you chase someone with high ping and instead of not chasing them you complain because it breaks your "cop roleplay" for not chasing them.

Back to the Thread: Lag can be your enemy and your ally at the same time. I have been chased many times and my ping (250-270) resulted on being my enemy than my ally. It's been easier for cops to PIT me than me trying to force my way out of a box. It's different if the suspect has an unstable lag spike, which is far more trouble for cops, that could have been a more valid point for this thread, than just throwing burning crapbags to every player that doesn't accept your ideas by just saying that they don't know what they are talking about and making those """stats""" just to make it look like those who voted 'no' have no relevance here.


Again, nobody is putting a pistol on your head and threating you to chase EVERY player you see.

[Tingle]

(2017-08-17 02:07)Ghutra Wrote:  So, now you try to disqualify those who voted 'no' just because they didn't have x XP, or x hs copping. It's not just a matter of saying "Oh, he voted no, he obviously doesn't know anything".

Quote:We can see that those who voted 'yes' had spent 68% more time as a cop than those who voted 'no', again, clearly showing those who voted 'yes' have more of an idea about the effects lag has on a chase than those who voted 'no'.

You don't even need to be a cop to note that high ping is an issue, so this isn't a matter of "this guy knows more just because he cops".

Just because some people don't cop here doesn't mean they didn't cop on another server. Altho this server is more advanced, the same principles remain.

What's the point of the country breakdown even for?.

Quote:If you had read more than just 5% of this thread, you would have seen there is a strong argument against that point.

The argument is that you get triggered everytime you chase someone with high ping and instead of not chasing them you complain because it breaks your "cop roleplay" for not chasing them.

Back to the Thread: Lag can be your enemy and your ally at the same time. I have been chased many times and my ping (250-270) resulted on being my enemy than my ally. It's been easier for cops to PIT me than me trying to force my way out of a box. It's different if the suspect has an unstable lag spike, which is far more trouble for cops, that could have been a more valid point for this thread, than just throwing burning crapbags to every player that doesn't accept your ideas by just saying that they don't know what they are talking about and making those """stats""" just to make it look like those who voted 'no' have no relevance here.


Again, nobody is putting a pistol on your head and threating you to chase EVERY player you see.

Correct, it is not a matter of saying "Oh, he voted no, he obviously doesn't know anything". But as the data shows, those who did vote no had significantly less copping experience (as indicated by XP and hours) than those who voted yes.

As for copping on other servers, I suspect this is an extremely small factor in this, not to mention the copping experience on other servers may be significantly different. It would be ridiculous to insinuate incorporating cop stats from other servers would improve the analysis.

As for the country breakdown, if you had used your eyes as much as you have used your hands to type your post, you would have seen it's just for insight and to show how divided countries were on the matter.

The fact of the matter is, it is not an even chase if the suspect is lagging, whether it is a ping spike or not, it is lag/an unstable connection. I am not saying 'no' voters have no relevance, however, for the majority of them, their opinion isn't as important when you have some with 0 hours copping experience. Take yourself for example, 0 hours copping and 0 cop XP.

You haven't made any mention of the fact that 'no' voters were significantly further away from the server either, have you? Is this not relevant or have you purposely decided to not mention it in your post?

Your criticism was appreciated but your comprehension of what myself and others have said is clearly not up to par. Perhaps it is due to some sort of language barrier but you've missed the point of my post by a big margin.

[Ghutra]

(2017-08-17 08:31)Tingle Wrote:  As for the country breakdown, if you had used your eyes as much as you have used your hands to type your post, you would have seen it's just for insight and to show how divided countries were on the matter.

Again, whats the point of showing how a voting has been going on different countries? Who cares if in GB the voting was even, or in NZ 100% voted yes?. It only cares if you voted YES or NO, not from where you voted. Does it make it more important because x voted from GB than PL?. This isn't a presidential election to even try to make the breakdown.

Quote:however, for the majority of them, their opinion isn't as important when you have some with 0 hours copping experience. Take yourself for example, 0 hours copping and 0 cop XP.

Again, just because you don't cop doesn't mean your opinions are irrelevant, correct or wrong, they are still opinions and have the same value.
Wanna know why I won't cop? Because of my PING (240-270ms). If it wasn't because of that I'd had applied for cop long time ago. I have TOW/MED-RES license yet I almost never go on-duty because the winch is the only tool I have because of my ping. I see it coming that people will cry because of my ping, more than cops do now.

Quote:It would be ridiculous to insinuate incorporating cop stats from other servers would improve the analysis.

Idk where you got that from coz' I never said that incorporating stats from other servers would make a difference. Small factor? true.

Quote:You haven't made any mention of the fact that 'no' voters were significantly further away from the server either, init? Is this not relevant or have you purposely decided to not mention it in your post?

Well, unless you want me to re-write the Old Testament into the New Testament, I'd of had mentioned it.
Still, its common sense that high ping users are trouble for both cops and suspects. Ye, most of these voters won't have the amount of hs and XP you have copping, but its up to them if they want to cop or not. You are free to choose if you want to be a robber or a cop, or both, or a rescue. Idk, maybe I'm the only one who voted 'no' discussing it deeply. Also, those who voted 'no' have more average miles than those who voted 'yes'. Weird, as 'yes' should of have more mileage than 'no'.....
Its not demanded to become a cop nor an obligation.

I see you didn't make a mention on the part where I explained you that high ping users have the ping against them, contrair to what you think, have you? Is this not relevant or have you purposely decided to not mention it?.

Quote:Perhaps it is due to some sort of language barrier

I don't see where the language barrier issue even has a part on this discussion.

In the end it's a cruise server, not a server to showoff how big your trunk is.

[Adorable]

Quote:#BanAllnonEUplayers

Wo woo? As if minus 2 seconds to the countdown timer do matter that much.

Let me reformat this for you so that you get a better understanding of what we're on about: COPs have a hard/annoying time catching players with a high ping, as a suggestion, Tingle thought of reducing the time it takes to bust them (from 5s to 3s), a few players refused the idea and some said that you shouldn't be chasing them at the first place, however that's just not right. It is a COPs n Robbers server and not COPs vs Robbers excluding laggers, Also, that will make Laggers able to do (nearly) whatever they want with no repercussions.

Quote:I don't see where the language barrier issue even has a part on this discussion.

It may does, considering you failed to grasp some of the issues discussed here.

Quote:Also, those who voted 'no' have more average miles than those who voted 'yes'. Weird, as 'yes' should of have more mileage than 'no'.....

Try average distance per individual.

---

Honestly why are we still discussing this? It is evident that this is not going anywhere.

there is only 1 person capable/care to make these changes, I suggest sending him a private message explaining to him the current "situation". He is the only one that has the power to attempt to balance this (if necessary).