Suggestions for Safety Rating feature

[Marty_Deslions]

Today the Safety Rating feature got updated.
You can read more information about it here:
https://forum.city-driving.co.uk/showthr...#pid295771

Because the feature is currently still in a test phase, I think it would be nice if we could share some things we would like to see implented in this system. If I missed out on anything, please feel free to write them down below.

1.
When the SR reaches zero, a player could recieve a ban. Maybe warn the player when his/her SR goes below 5% or something. This could improve his/her driving behavior.

2.
Before todays update, you were able to still gain SR / Safety Points when going OOB for instance. With the Westhill Retro map you could easily get out of the track, and drive OOB very fast to gain alot of Safety Points. Eventhough this has been fixed, the Top 100 Safety Point ranking is therefore still a bit untrustworthy, since not all points gained are within public roads. I think it would be fair to RESET the Top 100 Safety Points, so with this new update, the points seen on the Top 100 are only gained on public roads.

3.
As can be seem on the changelog page, when your SR is at 0-30%, you can only drive the UF1. I think it would be nice to add a few other low-speed vehicles like the Bicycle and maybe the Scooter.

4.
If a player wants to play as COP, he/she needs to be a safe driver, so a minimum percentage SR could be required to play as a COP.
In addition: This could also be implented to some other jobs, but I think COP has more of a role model kind of status.

[[RDSR] Ephwurd]

I have my suggestion for that, instead of affect players gameplay by negative way, do it on positive. Instead of restricting people to slower cars, give rewards for their safety rating. I don't know exact income sytem but if you are earning +3 by driving FZ5 normally, you may earn +4 if you are safe driver. Otherwise this system will be punishing guilty and innocent players.

I just drove my car safely like 10 kilometers and I got 2-3 crashes and they wasn't my bad at all. If you can create a system which can decide who has fault in crash it is ok but it looks like impossible. Also, TC team has like 30-35 admins. Players can report if they feel somebody has a fault, that's why there are admins.

One more thing, the future of TC. LFS has already small community when it is compared to other games. Think about that a new player got hits or make crashes by his own fault doesn't matter, he can't drive the car which he wants. As a result of that probably he will decide to leave from TC not even started. Do you think that people will able to drive UF1 for 150 kilometers without crashing to reach XFG? People playing for fun, not driving like a sheep 24/7. As I said above, people can report. I think there is no point in ending people's fun for the pleasure of a few sheep drivers. There is server two, they can drive 24/7 there without crashing. Do not forget it, it is just game. We can try somethings that is not possible in real life. That's the point of playing a game.

To be clear, instead of punishing people for driving, I suggest you try the reward system.

[Dino]

I am missing the option
„If you have an accident, you should be banned at least 7 up to 365 days depending on how hard the impact is, since you are likely to end up in hospital IRL and can’t drive for some time to make it more realistic.“

[SO•Huski]

Since this has been introduced on the scooter that I now mostly drive I have been involved in incidents which are not my fault, all of which have lost SA from between 3-6+ points. And this is in small periods of playtime (30m - 2hr) While I won't call anybody out being on a bike or scooter seems to make you a target for those in a car (especially on faster tracks) since smacking into the smaller things doesn't do much to you in a car (like in the real world I guess).

Right now I cant see a positive to punishing people for low SA as there's (from what I can see) no real way to pin blame, in much my same issues with Assetto Corsa Competizione and iRacing the SA systems aren't (in my opinion) fit for use as they mostly put joint punishment on each involved even if its a 100/0 90/10 blame percentage between 'aggressor'/'victim'. As without a human or 3 (for majority) in the loop you cannot 100% trust a computer to dedicate who's at fault. And even then humans get it wrong as well.

While we don't know yet the full plans or extents of what this system would do, in my OPINION it needs a dedicated think over to ensure it doesn't punish people who like to ride bikes, scooters and the like, as you could inadvertently punish people for other peoples lack of care and attention within the servers themselves.

While I don't think this system is bad, I'm partially looking in every so often to see the effects knocked on either directly or indirectly.

Also when did scooters become a punishment?! The T125 is great fun >:C

[megatronus8010]

This system makes no sense overall and should be completely thrown in the garbage because of something most scholars realized a couple of centuries ago.

" For a system to work all presumptive evidence of felony should be admitted cautiously, for the law holds that it is better that ten guilty persons escape than that one innocent suffer. "

But this implementation of SR is incredibly stupid. Even if someone rear ends you at 300km/h you will loose your rights to the car for no reason.

It needs major improvements before it's implemented.

[bayanofmansorofisky]

Instead of making the SR system somewhat of a punishment method.. Why not make it a reward system.
-For example, you get money for being safe
Like you get 1000 tc cash for every 20km with an SR above 95%
The less the SR the less the reward...like the trip system.

Utilizing this system as a new income/encouraging method for good behavior is a better idea imo
& whoever doesn't follow along and doesn't earn good SR will basically earn nothing, maybe have a small fee cut off his bank balance.

[M6nsh]

.......

Administrator Message by: Bez

2.2. Do not post provocative, outrageous, or pointless messages.

[[TC]►Vilix◄]

Updates and innovation to the server is always appreciated. I can respect that Chuck and PVL wish to implement new updates but I think in this case the community should be listened to.

Everyone's issue is that people get punished for accidents they weren't the cause of. As others have said, negative reinforcement only makes the situation worse, especially in a server like TC where crashes and accidents happen a lot, and regardless of if you were at fault, you get punished. As I've heard people who ride bikes already get hit enough randomly because people are too blind to see them, and some bikes are restricted already if your SR is below 90%. So the biker just ends up not being able to ride their bike because other people can't drive normally? I mean it's a joke. Also people can no longer perform towing through hitting/ramming, which in some cases is the best option.

In my opinion this system being tried out is great, but the feedback is clearly negative. I don't believe the current SR system belongs in TC, and its instantaneous approval and implementation is somewhat questionable considering most suggestions get ignored anyway.

[[RDSR] Misterviin]

Remove it

[[RDSR] Robis]

Quote:4.5. Roadblocks
Cops may set up roadblocks to stop a suspect. Randomly placed roadblocks are forbidden. The car(s) forming a roadblock must not move after it is in view of the suspect.
Cops participating in the chase may request cops who are outside the chase to set up roadblocks. The outside cops may not participate in any way other than setting up the roadblock. (ie they must not help to box the suspect)

So if cop outside from chase places roadblock and suspect comes through, both losing sr?

[◄Chuck►]

First off, this is a test and I'm open to any idea. And if the system turns out to be garbage, it's gone. No question there. However, in the meantime lets look at the current results.

I noticed there are often false assumptions, like this.

Quote:.. Even if someone rear ends you at 300km/h you will loose your rights to the car for no reason.

The amount of loss is determined by your own speed. The one who drove 300 might lose 5% but you only 1% or nothing if you were going <30kph.

(2022-10-22 20:52)Robis Wrote:  ...
So if cop outside from chase places roadblock and suspect comes through, both losing sr?

This case is partial problematic. Cops may not move with a roadblock, so they wont lose a thing. The robber however will lose something, Unfair or not? Hard to tell. At least he might think about the power he will put into that ram instead of just ploughing through flat out.


Sure, you will always get "unfair" hits. Its part of the deal. It was never the goal to keep 100% for everyone. The goal was rather to detect the tendency whether someone is a risk or not.


If you look at these two candidates here, you will agree that there must be something "wrong" with them. You can't blame such a rating purely on "unfair" hits.
And I think its a valid thought, that such people should not be allowed to use the Königsegg, for instance. Not until they've sorted their driving at least.

[[RDSR] ThePonczeK]

Remove it

[[TC]►BP◄]

Remove the restrictions as the system is currently open to heavy abuse as per the members thread

[SIMOX]

(2022-10-23 05:05)Chuck Wrote:  Sure, you will always get "unfair" hits. Its part of the deal. It was never the goal to keep 100% for everyone. The goal was rather to detect the tendency whether someone is a risk or not.


If you look at these two candidates here, you will agree that there must be something "wrong" with them. You can't blame such a rating purely on "unfair" hits.
And I think its a valid thought, that such people should not be allowed to use the Königsegg, for instance. Not until they've sorted their driving at least.

Yes you right i wrecked myself to 27% on purpose because i wasnt able to drive my bikes anymore without getting ww hit. Very fun when you get hit and SR drops below 90% then i take slow bike, gain it back, pick fast bike again, get ww again, drop below 90 again get speced, pick slow bike again, get ww on slow bike, grind even longer to 90%, then pick fast bike and then get hit again so SR is below 90% AGAIN. At that point i stopped giving a shit and just messed around.

Im not interested in driving slow cars to farm money because i dont need money. I got enough unlike pvl. And even then whats the point in spending 200k on a car if you wont be able to use it most of the time. This track is not even crash intensive like aston, south city or kyoto.

Point is, there should be no restrictions for vehicles because its simply not fun when you cant play with the car you like just because some donkey crashed into you. I told you that i gone from 72% to 0% on westhill retro by using just bike and driving normally. Was i messing? No, did i cause any trouble? Any ruined chases? Not really. It just showed how bullshit this system is and that it doesnt really work. Yes i like driving bikes fast so what? Am i not supposed to? Is this [TC] No Fun Allowed server?

Only adds toxicity to server, nothing else. Oh and btw, above 30% can drive trucks so good job on that. Surely bike can do more damage than a truck right? Lmao.

[[TC]►Frozen◄]

(2022-10-23 05:16)BP Wrote:  Remove the restrictions as the system is currently open to heavy abuse as per the members thread

Agreed.

[[TC]►Ras◄]

I think the limits where you lose vehicle classes could be tweaked, to possibly be more forgiving. The system is still very very new and early stages, so i can't give much opinion on it yet. So far i've done a 150km trip, doing multiple roles/jobs, and stayed around 98-100% the whole time, despite crashes, being in chases, etc. I've not personally experienced the bad side effects, that some are describing.

[SO•Yukine]

The system can't figure out on it's own who's the responsible of the collision.
It was already talked about in past, I don't believe the SR system, as it, is fair on any party.

Today I kept getting involved in crashes that were not my fault, but I still get penalized for it.

I don't want to imagine the ruckus that using bikes is, with the amount of people who refuse to acknowledge them and voluntary drive like penises around them disregarding their trip or SR.


With the current system, the "innocents" ones are the ones that ends up penalized.
I'm playing on TC to have fun & chill, not to get stressed at the second I drive in traffic.

[SO•Sebas]

I'll just leave this here, seen yesterday while playing:

"I'm sorry I can't help you flipping your car back, it would be hurtful to my SR."

The safety system was a failure on other servers in the past and ended up being removed eventually (such as RC). The amount of negatives (such as abuse and unfair crashes) severely outweigh the positives IMO.

I'm with several other players, this system should be removed all together.

[[RDSR] Kiwie]

I will throw my two cent's here too. I fully agree with players here that this system is not gonna work. First of all, I think we all can agree that this is just a game. Why do we play this game? To have some fun, enjoy driving and so on. I personally get on this game and server to relax my mind and have fun with friends. With this system all that is not possible because I have to avoid other players to feel safe and not lose my SR because of some donkeys. Also its impossible to relax your mind because you have to be stressed all the time about not losing your SR. This system doesn't allow us to enjoy this game at all because it has more down sides than up sides. Lets not turn this great server into complete joke.

[Josh]

Personally I wasn't keen on the idea when I read about it. After trying it for a few days, so far, I haven't had any issues with my SR dropping significantly while playing.

I have been crashed into a few times in a short period of time and my SR hasn't dropped much below 90.0 and it quickly starts to rise again. This is playing as COP and CIV.

I would urge people to try it (who have no previous experience of such system, like me) and see how it works out.

Remember this is still at an early stage and I would imagine would be open to significant changes.

Josh.