Rule against Scam

[KooKoo]

Hello,

There should be a rule preventing people from scamming others. Sometimes people are new or some people don't know english and they get scammed.

Like today, an incident happened where Atbiz (atbizgames) was offering an FZ5 for sale, one for 17k and the other 35k, one person sent him 17k and Atbiz sent him an FZ5 condition 0.1% and its value is 36 Euros. Pretty annoying right?

Just looking at the situation is really annoying and pisses people off, not to mention he sent the car and immediately left the server.

This is a suggestion to implement a rule to prevent scamming, and if it were not to be followed it's the seller's fault

I.e Seller's should always share the VIN of the car their selling.

Something like that.

Thanks.

[[TC-R] Luke]

Obviously it's your risk when it comes to buying 2nd cars directly, so unfortunately there's little we can do in most cases. You need to be careful on what you buy by checking out the details.

We don't really tolerate scam and we can't really place a rule on everything so the current rules usually link up as a general area. You could say scamming is a form of disrespect etc. It's really complicated and difficult for us to get the sufficient evidence really so making a rule wouldn't make much difference. It's common sense anyways, we do not allow it.

Refunds are often eligible if the evidence is sufficient

[[TC]►Dizzle◄]

Had a short discussion about this last night. I do agree with you to an extent. A system could be added to confirm a car purchase showing the condition and value.

But then it could become more confusing.

[KooKoo]

What sort of evidence is required in this case luke; A player advertises prices of cars and when players ask for VIN he does not give it till a person who has no knowledge of the idea of selling and buying pays 17k and gets a 0.1% FZ5? Especially since he has like literally less than 6k, I think. So he basically paid 17k for a 36$ worth car. This makes me angry even though I didn't buy.

Edit: after the buyer left the pits he wanted a refund from the seller, but the seller left. I think the seller left to avoid being in problems.

[atbizgames]

post deleted by user.

[KooKoo]

seriously? You are going to scam because there's nothing against it? The dude does not know english, or at least how to communicate with you.

And it just pisses him off and us too seing the way you did it. Send the car, leave immediately to avoid problems.

[atbizgames]

post deleted by user.

[KooKoo]

That's because they already know the method and they mostly sell and buy with other arabs

[Olli]

(2015-07-21 01:29)atbizgames Wrote:  not avoiding problems, since an admin told me I have right to sell cars if people don't ask for vins.

So you deliberately took advantage of that. Yes, it's the buyer's job to check whether the car he/she is about buy is actually worth anything. But, on the example KooKoo provided - it's crystal clear that your intention was to trick the buyer. It makes me sad and mad that some users get utterly scammed on our servers. Since there isn't a rule describing that scamming is prohibited, nothing can really be done in this situation. But, I seriously do hope that something would be done to prevent people from getting deliberately scammed.

[◄Chuck►]

Ditto. However, rule 1.1 forbids abuse of other players. If this isn't abuse, then what is?

[[TC]►BP◄]

Atbizgames, that just shows what type of person you are.

[KooKoo]

I hope the buyer gets a full refund.

Atbiz, Don't get this wrong but it's the truth, now I know why you're kicked from SO, you basically troll about everything and even disrupt others, but you took it to a level where it's not acceptable anymore.

Just looking at the situation when the buyer left the pits makes people mad, how depressed are you for money?

[Sadie]

Think this broke rule 1.1 yes.

Atbiz: Really, abusing/tricking other players like this JUST for getting enough money for gumball and a FZ5 so you maybe have a chance to win?

[Dan]

If you, Atbiz, outright stated that the car was worth €17k, made another user send you that amount and then you gave them a car that was only 0.1%, that is lying, falsifying and extremely disrespectful. Language isn't a factor here. Anybody can understand the basics: "FZ5 for 17k" > send money > send car. You outright fooled another user into buying a car with a value of 17k, when, going by a previous figure, was only €36.

I might as well say it, but what has gotten into you Atbiz recently? Your consistent trolling is becoming very boring and extremely annoying. There's nothing wrong with naming and shaming, since you fooled an innocent player, which you deserve to be banned for, and shows nothing more than who you really are.

[[TC-R] Luke]

(2015-07-21 00:44)KooKoo Wrote:  What sort of evidence is required in this case luke; A player advertises prices of cars and when players ask for VIN he does not give it till a person who has no knowledge of the idea of selling and buying pays 17k and gets a 0.1% FZ5? Especially since he has like literally less than 6k, I think. So he basically paid 17k for a 36$ worth car. This makes me angry even though I didn't buy.

Edit: after the buyer left the pits he wanted a refund from the seller, but the seller left. I think the seller left to avoid being in problems.

Evidence that is clear enough for us in Chatlogs and Insim Statistics. In this case it's obvious the buyer didn't look up the car first, however, if they are inexperienced or struggle to speak English, it's a common thing.

We need to be able to see that transaction was completed, the suggested amount of money was sent and the car was also sent. Plus the conversations between the 2 users, where do the "lies" or "incorrect" details come in? There's a lot for us to check for all this information and sometimes it can be unclear. Situations where somebody sends the money but, fails to receive the car are a little more awkward.

It's usually the conversation that gives us the evidence (in the cases I've dealt with anyways). Since that is the easiest place to break a rule. As Chuck rightly said, if this isn't abusing a player (1.1 Respect all players at all times) then what is?

I've always hinted for more scam protection after a case because it does seem to be too common especially in cases like this. Usually, a lot of people have different opinions making the decision difficult to go with.

[KooKoo]

Atbiz only said FZ5 for sale 17k / 36k, Tameem sent 17k and got a 36 worth car. When other users asked for a VIN, he failed to give it and had to wait for someone to pay. The guy does not know how the system of selling and buying cars work I assume, he just saw an fz5, a car he always wanted, and tried purchasing it off someone.

I still think Atbiz broke rule 1.1.

There should be something more to prevent this and please refund the player at least. Should be a bannable offence.

[[6S] Mufflord]

And i suddenly lost my respect for you atbiz. This is really taking it too far.
I agree but if something can be done let's do it? New players shouldn't get scammed beacuse of their in-experience.

[Deaky]

Wtf atbiz, thats really cheap....

(2015-07-21 09:02)KooKoo Wrote:  Atbiz, Don't get this wrong but it's the truth, now I know why you're kicked from SO, you basically troll about everything and even disrupt others, but you took it to a level where it's not acceptable anymore.

Kookoo, you piss me off for saying something that is not true, get your facts right ty

[[TC-R] Luke]

Keep the comments mature please. It may not have been a respectable decision by Atbiz, but it's not something to be discussed about in here.

What's done has been done, keep it as that. Any more and the thread with locked so stay on topic.

[[TC]►Cam◄]

1.1 needs more clarity