Suggestions for Safety Rating feature

[Adorable]

(2022-10-26 21:12)TAZxx Wrote:  There's a lot more I could say on the subject... But if the idea is to be stricter on those who cannot drive or break the rules, that needs to come from an administrative stand-point...

This ^

[Dino]

(2022-10-24 04:27)Chuck Wrote:  I will give it at least to Friday

[[RDSR] Roba]

While I wasn't against this idea at the start, I can't really find a very good usage for this system for what it's currently intended for. A minimum change required would be that the SR change is not instant, and would never force spectate you for driving faster car than allowed. Maybe it would change only when pitting/speccing, or leaving the server completely.

Second option would be to leave it for a reference to admins only.

But all in all I do not appreciate loosing SR everytime someone else hits me due to their own incompetence. I liked the idea for sure, but it's likely way too difficult to build to work properly. People would constantly need refunding of the SR points they lost due to someone ramming them, which would just cause much more work for admins.

[◄Chuck►]

I'd really be interested in ideas how to make use of it. Or what other functions can be based on it. Other than just saying "its all garbage, remove it". That's not really constructive and narrow-minded.

That "200kph on the wrong side" is one of the often mentioned examples, and yes it feels unfair and is a bit of lottery, but there is still some truth in it. It happens quite a lot that people come the wrong way, and it's then up to a real good driver to make the best out of it. A real good driver could have anticipated the situation and would be prepared, not surprised. I personally translate a "SIREN" on screen with "MORON WRONG WAY" and it often saved me. Hazard perception is one of most important topics when going for a drivers licence.

And then there is another factor. I'd call it "masculinity" factor. As soon a number is rating ones driving, everyone just felt like "I'm the best driver around here, so the number must show 100% for me at all times, because I'm simply the best. And if its not showing that number, the number must be wrong"

[[RDSR] Roba]

While I appreciate your intentions and way of thought, I don't think it's possible to filter out ramming/wrong way crashing properly.

Example:
I am a cop. I drive down the Highway at the speedlimit of 160kph. I have spotted potential speeders/wrong way drivers behind me, so once I've set my speed and driving line, I look behind. What I do not see, is the oncoming car on the wrong side of the road, coming also at the speed of 160km/h, behind the notch so out of visual line of sight, and before that behind the Insim speedlimit sign that's placed on top of the map, covering small part of the highway.

This ends up as a full head-on crash with no room to react, and instantly costing me, who did everything by law and took everything into account to generally avoid such situation, a little over 5 SR points.

Now if this happened twice at relatively short timespan, I would already be restricted to lower classes, which I deem unnecessary and unfair.

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So first thought of this is, that if the SR is not refundable, and it will always affect negatively on the innocent party as well, the pace of loosing SR should be halved immediately.

[[TC]►Vilix◄]

Since a lot of the feedback is "people instantly hate when they haven't properly tried it" this is a proper evaluation from my side.

From my personal experience, yesterday I decided to drive XRT on blackwood retro and go the reverse way (not the way everyone usually drives). In the time span of 10 minutes, my SR dropped from 100% to 80%, as people kept arab drifting into me, or they are just senselessly driving over in the other lane. However the result was that the next morning I couldn't cruise with my team on bikes or in fast cars that require 90% or above.

The system is fundamentally flawed in my opinion. In a game like LFS and a server like TC, people who play, generally aren't here to obey the rules of the road and drive like an NPC. Hence people don't treat the game as seriously, and are instead here to enjoy the freedom that comes with the server. So it makes no sense in my mind to use a punishment system rather than a reward system. This has been already suggested before, but instead of punishing players who do nothing wrong, why not reward them instead? I mean restricting people who aren't good drivers might be a good idea, but so far the execution has been far from optimal.

Also, is people speeding in the game really being used to justify the system on the punishment it gives? The whole point of the game is to be a racing game, and yes it is a "city driving" server but people drive deliberately fast since years and years ago, so why now is that being brought up?

Other ideas that have been brought up such as only admins being able to view the SR and it having no direct impact on a player might be viable. However, from what I've been reading on this thread and the replies it's quite clear you must admit that on average, people are unhappy with the system and it needs to be either removed or revised.

[SO•Yukine]

Posting my experience from today, I guess.

My SR was low, about 33% due to shenanigans I did the other day.

Today I went to drive a Suzuki Swift, both to "have fun" and also gain back the SR to get back into reasonable levels.

It didn't take long for a wrong way driver to hit me head-on, on the highway, which caused me to plunge to 29%.

I drove the UF1 until I reached 33% again, then switched to the Swift and once again, a wrong way driver hit me head on, which caused me to go back to 29%.

I was driving the UF1 again, and then.. once again hit head on by a FZ5 driving on the wrong side of the road at high speeds, causing me to plunge at 26%.

I understand that I'm a bad little duck for having a low SR, yaddi yadda.

But what was my fault for going under 33% in the first place?
I don't know, I was driving peacefully on my lane at appropriate speeds (Swift & UF1 aren't supercars).

Three questions:
- How do I regain my rights to drive something else than a UF1 if I constantly get hit by wrong way drivers; report everybody on forums, go drive alone on TC2?

- What if instead of a Bicycle, Swift & Tamago driver I was a high performance car? I would lose my right to drive them and have fun every two minutes (it takes two crashes by ww drivers to go under 90%)?

- Do people who drives high performance cars (supercars / superbikes) deserve to get their rights removed after a couple of crashes?

Here's one of the four wrong way crash I suffered from.




If I'm driving on a "cruise" server, how I'm supposed to act with people driving at +160kph? I don't get the time to react, should we diminish everybody's SR for going +10kph over the speed limit?

From my point of view and considering that it's been quite few days the system was implemented, I only see the system as a flawed way to replace admins.
The system can't determine who's at fault and will penalize unfairly.

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Quote:That "200kph on the wrong side" is one of the often mentioned examples, and yes it feels unfair and is a bit of lottery, but there is still some truth in it. It happens quite a lot that people come the wrong way, and it's then up to a real good driver to make the best out of it. A real good driver could have anticipated the situation and would be prepared, not surprised.

Did you notice we're on a "cruise" server, not on a real F1 drivers training sim?

We're from all backgrounds, with all kind of computers, with all kind of reaction times and all kind of experience.
It's not everyday you can find somebody driving 120kph and manage to avoid a wrong sider going 200kph.
In the real world that results in casualties and a news article.

How does a "real good driver" avoid such a situation, driving on grass, oob, flying away?
Where do you find people with reaction times that are inhuman?
You can anticipate a chase by slowing down or somebody at an intersection, but not somebody who suddenly goes wrong way at high speed or in a corner. We don't all have ultrawide screens, from far cars are tiny pixels.

[SO•Marty]

My suggestions:
- Disable SR when MED/RES/TOW is on a call or in the vicinity of a call. As a CIV I don't dare anymore to help anyone, which can't be the point of SR.
- Do !sorry or lose SR. At least the victim (in case there is a clear blame) will get something, especially if the person at fault is close to losing access to a certain car.


The main issue for me is that the system is unable to detect who's at fault or at least share blame equally. I still think that 98% of all (heavy) crashes happen because of mistakes, not out of maliciousness. Even when people are stunting or do weird stuff in the road, a heavy crash involving users not playing part in it often is apologised for. Should people lose access to cars because of mistakes they make? I don't believe so, and if they do act out of bad intent, there is still !tc and !report. This feels to me like it's trying to replace !tc instead of actually benefitting the users.

[January]

I'm with those who vote to remove it.

Maybe SR is useful but in a different way

Example: Someone up to 0%, the system sends direct messages to online administrators informing them of this specific person.

But how does SR work now? It just drives people to the point of madness, except for driving in the game and having fun, you have to be completely focused on others mistake or about every single thing. If there is a blind spot like that one on the middle of Highway in Blackwood, you have to slow down as much possible you could because there might be someone who is stunted and you won't be able to see them because the speed limit sign is obscuring the mini-map. btw it already happened to Robis.

There's no point in repeating what people have already said in this thread, there are a lot of things I could mention but they have already mentioned. TC are appreciated and respected for its progress, but listening to the community will make it even better.

Robis's Thread